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Post by Mackerelman on Feb 15, 2023 17:12:12 GMT -5
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Post by fishsci on Feb 15, 2023 21:28:40 GMT -5
How many here have made reasonable constructive comments to suggest acceptable sabiki bait rig regulations on the pier? Very small hooks and very light line should be a reasonable compromise -- but only if sent to the Commission. Just talking about the possible problem solves nothing.
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Post by fishfinderbill on Feb 15, 2023 21:33:28 GMT -5
I agree with small hook light line Sabikis. If FWC's ideas go into effect it won't be until May. I thought I read that it would only pertain to the SSP but I can't find that article. If pelican problems are caused by Sabiki rigs why wouldn't they suggest a ban on all Fla. waters and not just SPs.
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Post by Mackerelman on Feb 16, 2023 0:11:58 GMT -5
Since there was No Proof of Fisherman Harming Any Birds, the FWC had to decide on something.
This Idea was thought up to get the Bird People off the FWC's back.
Let's keep in mind, the Bird People first wanted to Shut down Both Piers. That didn't work.
Then they wanted to limit each person to 1 Pole. That didn't work either.
Now the Sabikis are getting the blame.
The Ban will is Only supposed to be in place for 1 year to see if the Bird People are right. Which they are not.
If the Bird People stops Feeding the Birds for 1 Year, the Birds will go away. Which is the Bird Peoples Fault by starting this Crap for Feeding the Birds.
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Post by fishfinderbill on Feb 16, 2023 21:49:35 GMT -5
This bird vs fisherman stuff appears to me to be an offshoot of the "Cancel culture" that is being fostered today. A small group of people,who don't like something, creates such a fuss that the governing body has to make a decision that may or may not effect the majority. What's next? The Dolphin people will say that pin fish can not be used for bait because the dolphins may get hooked. Or how about shutting down I275, all the exhaust from the cars and trucks can't be good for animal or bird life. Where will it end??
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Post by carlf on Feb 17, 2023 7:25:32 GMT -5
There has always been a cancel culture, on all sides of the political spectrum.
Now its just more easy to broadcast it to the entire world.
Small loud groups get all the attention while the apathetic majority sits back in silence.
Same crape, difference century.
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Post by mackeralsnatcher on Feb 21, 2023 8:14:44 GMT -5
Agree
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Post by fishsci on Feb 21, 2023 11:34:14 GMT -5
Blaming the problem on feeding the birds is not helpful, but instead harms our case because it largely is not true The reason that pelicans and other birds are around the SSP is that they come there to feed on the huge numbers of bait fish there in large schools. The bait fish are there to use the pier as refuge from predatory fish.
The Bird People only feed during the coldest part of the winter when there are few bait fish, and what bait fish are there stay too deep for the pelicans to dive on.
So stopping feeding the birds would solve very little of the problem. However, feeding wildlife in state parks is usually forbidden, and there probably are laws against it, so it should not be allowed at the piers. Some have even suggested that feeding the birds harms pelicans, because it causes them to not make their normal migration further south during the winter, even though there is not enough food for them to stay healthy. The small amount of food provided by the birders is not nearly enough to keep them healthy. It just keeps them in an area where they should normally not be.
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Post by Mackerelman on Feb 21, 2023 13:21:48 GMT -5
1. If the Bird People stops feeding the Birds, the Birds will go elsewhere for their food. a. From the 1970's We never had a Bird Problem until just a few Years ago when Jeanette (of the Friends of Pelicans) got Fired from the Piers. b. She told the Management that she either gets re-hired or she would shut down the Piers somehow, some way. Management refused to Re-Hire her. Then, The Crap Started. 2. Throwing Bait by the Friends of Pelicans & other Bird People is what Attracted the Birds in the First Place. 3. Feeding the Pelicans & Other Birds is Illegal & Banned at Most Piers in Florida. Read the Signs that are Posted & Read the Rules on the Entry Ticket posted below. Rule #7  4. When My Own Kids left home & got Married, they and their families came back home just to eat. When I stopped feeding them, they went elsewhere to eat or ate at their home. a. Animals & Fish are the same way as My Kids were. 5. Feed a stray Dog or Cat or Any Other Animal if You don't believe Me. |
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Post by kingmackerelman on Feb 21, 2023 14:30:11 GMT -5
Blaming the problem on feeding the birds is not helpful, but instead harms our case because it largely is not true The reason that pelicans and other birds are around the SSP is that they come there to feed on the huge numbers of bait fish there in large schools. The bait fish are there to use the pier as refuge from predatory fish. The Bird People only feed during the coldest part of the winter when there are few bait fish, and what bait fish are there stay too deep for the pelicans to dive on. So stopping feeding the birds would solve very little of the problem. However, feeding wildlife in state parks is usually forbidden, and there probably are laws against it, so it should not be allowed at the piers. Some have even suggested that feeding the birds harms pelicans, because it causes them to not make their normal migration further south during the winter, even though there is not enough food for them to stay healthy. The small amount of food provided by the birders is not nearly enough to keep them healthy. It just keeps them in an area where they should normally not be. where is your proof |
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Post by kingmackerelman on Feb 21, 2023 14:30:44 GMT -5
1. If the Bird People stops feeding the Birds, the Birds will go elsewhere for their food. a. From the 1970's We never had a Bird Problem until just a few Years ago when Jeanette (of the Friends of Pelicans) got Fired from the Piers. b. She told the Management that she either gets re-hired or she would shut down the Piers somehow, some way. Management refused to Re-Hire her. Then, The Crap Started. 2. Throwing Bait by the Friends of Pelicans & other Bird People is what Attracted the Birds in the First Place. 3. Feeding the Pelicans & Other Birds is Illegal & Banned at Most Piers in Florida. Read the Signs that are Posted & Read the Rules on the Entry Ticket posted below. Rule #7 View Attachment4. When My Own Kids left home & got Married, they and their families came back home just to eat. When I stopped feeding them, they went elsewhere to eat or ate at their home. a. Animals & Fish are the same way as My Kids were. 5. Feed a stray Dog or Cat or Any Other Animal if You don't believe Me. fed a homeless guy once and he followed me home and harrassed my grandkids...never again |
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Post by fishsci on Feb 21, 2023 17:59:55 GMT -5
Blaming the problem on feeding the birds is not helpful, but instead harms our case because it largely is not true The reason that pelicans and other birds are around the SSP is that they come there to feed on the huge numbers of bait fish there in large schools. The bait fish are there to use the pier as refuge from predatory fish. The Bird People only feed during the coldest part of the winter when there are few bait fish, and what bait fish are there stay too deep for the pelicans to dive on. So stopping feeding the birds would solve very little of the problem. However, feeding wildlife in state parks is usually forbidden, and there probably are laws against it, so it should not be allowed at the piers. Some have even suggested that feeding the birds harms pelicans, because it causes them to not make their normal migration further south during the winter, even though there is not enough food for them to stay healthy. The small amount of food provided by the birders is not nearly enough to keep them healthy. It just keeps them in an area where they should normally not be. where is your proof My proof? Have you and every fisherman on the piers not seen hundreds of pelicans diving on the big schools of bait the piers? Do you think they are diving to do tricks to get someone to feed them? I have never been on the piers and seen someone feeding them, yet I have always see many pelicans hen schools of bait are showing on the surface. If you fish in the bay in a boat, wherever there are big schools of bat showing, you will see a lot of pelicans. Nowhere in the bay are large schools of bait more regularly abundant than around the piers. That is why the cast-netters come their to catch bait to fish with or to catch them to sell from their bait barges. |
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Post by Mackerelman on Feb 21, 2023 18:16:42 GMT -5
People, Don't Argue or Discuss anything with fishsci.
He Always thinks that He is always Right and is the Only One in the Room.
I am Done reading his crap.
Do Not Antagonize him.
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Post by stuckintherocks on Feb 21, 2023 18:48:23 GMT -5
Alls I know is… f*ck those pelicans… the huge schools of bait definitely are what brought the pelicans in but the people feedin em ain’t helpin either.. literally just a couple of hours ago I was facing the trunk of my car squatted down unhooking a small mackerel… when I feel and notice a pelican land behind me.. didn’t think much of it as he was jus beggin for food but I sh!t you not this pelican had the audacity to try to steal the mackerel straight from my hand when my back was turned.. bit the hell outta my hand and that sh!t hurt !! A pelican just in the wild would have never had the balls to do that so I experienced first hand (literally) the negative effects of the pelicans being fed by and desensitized to humans..
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Post by saltybass on Feb 21, 2023 21:54:31 GMT -5
Fishsci is right about feeding pelicans having almost 0 impact.
They should knock down the east spans to eliminate the daytime roosting spots. This would reduce the amount of all birds in the area. Birds would only be around to feed and would then leave. Baitfish schools might be less too which would lessen the number of birds. The people & cars traveling the pier would keep the birds from overtaking the pier. Birds would find better areas to feed that are closer to resting areas.
None of the proposals by the bird activists will make any impact either.
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Post by fishsci on Feb 21, 2023 22:12:42 GMT -5
People, Don't Argue or Discuss anything with fishsci. He Always thinks that He is always Right and is the Only One in the Room. I am Done reading his crap. Do Not Antagonize him. If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen. If you can't deal with rational facts, keep on saying that your irrational opinions are facts. |
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Post by Flatsrunner on Feb 21, 2023 22:30:32 GMT -5
Just read a article in the Tampa bay times that the FWC was hesitant to implement the proposed new rules for the piers and has reversed course on any changes for now, Their concerned that it would damage the sport of fishing on the piers. This is a setback for FOP groups which are not happy. I'm sure it will be brought back up at their next meeting in July I think. Yes I agree with Saltybass about removing the old spans to take away staging spots for the pelicans, It seems that enough people spoke up and made their opinions known. I'm sure this is not the last we will hear from the FOP group over the pelicans.
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Post by seabird on Feb 22, 2023 8:46:55 GMT -5
Just read a article in the Tampa bay times that the FWC was hesitant to implement the proposed new rules for the piers and has reversed course on any changes for now, Their concerned that it would damage the sport of fishing on the piers. This a setback for FOP groups which are not happy. I'm sure it will be brought back up at their next meeting in July I think. Yes I agree with Saltybass about removing the old spans to take away staging spots for the pelicans, It seems that enough people spoke up and made their opinions known. I'm sure this is not the last we will hear from the FOP group over the pelicans. I hope that people writing in has had impact. I sure have done so. Glad FWC apparently concerned about our sport. If you have not written in...please do so. Thanks. |
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Post by bluerunner on Feb 23, 2023 18:38:53 GMT -5
Anyone got any videos of his karen attracting the pelicans with bait? Why is she campaigning for the pelicans, but at the same time killing fish to feed them? Why must one species be saved, only to ignore another?
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Post by Mackerelman on Feb 23, 2023 20:24:52 GMT -5
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Post by seabird on Feb 23, 2023 20:50:51 GMT -5
Keep those video tapes coming! |
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Post by Captain John on Feb 23, 2023 21:27:33 GMT -5
That is crazy...
How can their voices Cary any weight with videos like this showing they are breaking the posted rules.
They should ban those groups from being on the pier. Let them find another cause, like training the pelicans to look before they fly???
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Post by Mackerelman on Feb 23, 2023 21:39:14 GMT -5
That is crazy... How can their voices Cary any weight with videos like this showing they are breaking the posted rules. They should ban those groups from being on the pier. Let them find another cause, like training the pelicans to look before they fly??? The Friends of Pelicans Lied to Everyone. The Piers tried to Ban those people but The State of Florida says Everyone has a Right to be on the Piers since the the Piers are State Owned. |
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Post by mackeralsnatcher on Feb 25, 2023 12:12:18 GMT -5
While I appreciate y'all's concern and passion, you need to know that all the concern and passion you have will have zero effect on the final ruling.
Fact is the bird people have a louder voice then the fishermen.
Why is that?
Glad you asked.
It's because the bird people are proactive and the fishermen are apathetic.
Sad but true.
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Post by Flatsrunner on Feb 25, 2023 14:01:21 GMT -5
I don't think all fishermen are apathetic as you assume, the last month or two posts have been mostly covering the topic you seem to think they don't care about. Not all people know the issues that could effect the piers or follow this forum or any other social media sites that have input. Most anglers don't have the time to create a false narrative like the FOP did and spread the lies to the media and FWC. Most anglers want fishing reports and techniques, not to be blamed for something they did not do. The anglers that have commented must of had some effect on the decision to reverse the proposed rulings.
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Post by Mackerelman on Feb 25, 2023 18:44:24 GMT -5
I don't think all fishermen are apathetic as you assume, the last month or two posts have been mostly covering the topic you seem to think they don't care about. Not all people know the issues that could effect the piers or follow this forum or any other social media sites that have input. Most anglers don't have the time to create a false narrative like the FOP did and spread the lies to the media and FWC. Most anglers want fishing reports and techniques, not to be blamed for something they did not do. The anglers that have commented must of had some effect on the decision to reverse the proposed rulings. You hit it right on the head. The Anglers did not cause this. I have never heard of or seen anyone trying to hurt any Birds. I have even lent a hand untangling Birds from Angler's Lines. The Birds have also taken My Fish but I did not try to hurt any of the Birds. Jeanette & the FOP are the ones responsible for the hurting & death of the birds. 2 1/2 Years ago I got wrapped up into 2 Birds in 1 hour of Fishing. I could not believe how many birds were at the Piers. Then when I moved to a different spot to Fish is when one of the FOP people got Me hooked by My Own Spoon when I was untangling line wrapped around a bird. Then when I asked someone that I cannot name at the Piers, what was causing all of the Birds at the Piers is when I heard that Jeanette & the FOP were feeding the birds. Then 2 others told Me the same thing. That is when various people started filming the FOP & their associates feeding the Birds. If everyone here on this site would have listened to what was said at the meetings, they would hear both sides. Some of You people do not get it. Jeanette & the FOP & their followers want the Piers shut down after they heard Jeanette & the FOP lies. I could not Post that Video of the FOP people feeding the Birds until the FWC saw it & it was released to the Public. There are more Videos out there of the Bird People feeding the Birds. The FWC knows who is responsible. But the FWC also wants the Awareness out there. I don't like being accused of something that I didn't do. How about the Rest of You? |
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Post by Flatsrunner on Feb 25, 2023 19:32:41 GMT -5
The whole idea of a angler holding a pelican still enough to scalp a pelican's head and completely peeling back the top of it's head is a task that's nearly impossible without attracting attention from other people, I hooked a bird in the foot once years ago and it was not very happy, I took a beating without any help in a kayak. From the news coverage I seen only one person interviewed other than FOP and media was biased in their coverage. It's a joke to watch those FOP people dump bait after bait over that pier trying to entice the pelican off the old bridge railing and not concerned about all the birds they are educating for a new food source. Enough on this nonsense and lets go fishing..
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Post by fishfinderbill on Feb 25, 2023 21:14:57 GMT -5
Once again, Please go to the FWC web site and voice your opinions about birds and Sabiki rigs. It's not hard to do and is worth more than you think. I feel FWC folks are smarter than we give them credit for.
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